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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2016 0:10:43 GMT
As in the video you'll probably want to put a diagonal between the camera and the reducer. It needs a long distance to get it down to 0.63 (google jim thompson focal reducers). And need the diagonal otherwise you run out of room to the base of the mount. And have you bought this stuff ? There's a great sale on at bintel now. Hi Chris, all i have been away for a wedding I was driven to central NSW long trip glad to be back home ! No I have not purchased anything yet as I'm still procrastinating! No not really just a little priority change. I'm wanting to get a back yard Observatory set up and may put funds into this project before I set up my Video Astronomy set up. All this will take some time and money . Because I want to get a Sky Pod Observatory not cheap but I would like to have this set up before next winter. Then get back to thinking about Video Astronomy, but may simplify things a bit due to lack of funds and start with the R2 into my TV. Will keep you posted once things happen. Thanks for for everyone's help regards David.
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Post by Dragon Man on Nov 22, 2016 11:28:52 GMT
All good Dave Keep us in the loop mate.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2017 22:49:57 GMT
Hi all, Hope everyone is well, while I wait for my observatory to arrive I ponder how I will set the scope up inside the observatory. With the scope set up like I have shown you in the previous posts it was set up for visual observing. But these scopes are very well built and solid , in the 8" style the forks and mount are very solid and the tripod in the lowered position is solid. So to my point and getting into Video Astronomy I have 2 trains of thoughts on setting the scope up in the observatory. My first idea was to buy a wedge for the scope and the price of a new wedge is $799 ! Ouch. I was thinking of setting up the base of my observatory like this, www.cloudynights.com/topic/410740-darc-star-observatory-rises/Then I would get put the Observatory around this set up, looks fine to me , then get my reducers camera etc and away we go. Now my other thoughts are do a plain concrete slab thick 150mm put the observatory on that then leave the scope in its configuration as it is now and get the Hyperstar. www.cloudynights.com/topic/549819-first-light-c8-hyperstar-with-atik-infinity-color-on-a-moonlit-night/Now I may not use the Atik infinity camera maybe the GStar or something like. But the cost of doing either is about the same! But I ask most objects in the sky are small yes I understand you like to have fast F ratio but you also need focal length . Otherwise you have small object on the screen. Yes the Orion Nebula is one thing but you get past 100 or so objects and the rest are very small and you need FL to bring them in. Or your just imaging the same old objects all the time. Please tell me if I'm wrong ? Also I want to Video Astronomy the moon and planets will Alt / Az be ok ? These are things I need to settle on before the observatory arrives so final plans can be drawn up and if I need to get the wedge . Any advice appreciated, David.
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Post by howie1 on Jan 6, 2017 23:20:06 GMT
David,
We are always limited by what we are looking at in combination with our equipment. Its always a compromise. From watching live broadcasters on NSN using Infinities and other cameras on Alt Az mounts and SCT's here's what I think for the kit you have currently.
1. Lots of EAA'ers using hyperstar on the SCT's with small'ish sensor camera's (because they vignette less with reducers like hyperstar). Why? Because it reduces the F ratio to enable short exposures, plus smaller sensor cameras operate like smaller sized EP's ... IE increase magnification.
2. Lots of EAA'ers using cropping to 'zoom' in on the smaller stuff, to get around the reduced focal length created by hyperstar. Yes they get fuzzier but that's the compromise. You cannot beat physics. Unless you do as Mark Bahu did which is buy some crazy heavy duty mount from France which carries 130 pounds easily. He's also got heaps of cameras. I think he said recently in a live broadcast he had 20! So he's mounting several scopes side by side, all with camera's specifically matching highly sensitive, small sensored cameras on long focal length scopes for the really small and dim stuff. And other large sensor cameras on other scopes for medium and large stuff both bright and dim. Not many of us have that luxury! It's ideal, but ... !!
3. Lots of EAA'ers using GEM's for the above points 1 and 2. Not that many using Alt Az ... but ... there are indeed some, and they are doing it well. But they have to compromise. The problem is field rotation limiting the length of exposure time on Alt Az ... in combination with the need to get more focal length for the small stuff which you realise is a problem as per your post.
So the compromise for SCT on AltAz like you wish to do is ... (a) going as long as they can in exposure time with (b) hyperstar even when its small stuff and (c) stacking to improve signal to noise so the resulting image isn't too shabby and (d) cropping the image to 'zoom' in.
Personally, having seen the ease of use of the Infinity or Lodestar equivalent both with proven software and proven for the above hyperstar'ed SCT's on AltAz ... that's what I'd be going for. Sorry for the Aussie GStar camera but I have never seen that proven in that combination of small object, SCT hyperstar, AltAz, fast acquisition with easy to use stacking software. The Infinity and Lodestar I have seen on NSN live.
So if you setup your obs with the pier and the SCT in Alt Az with hyperstar and whatever cam you buy ... go for it! Then, if you find you just cannot easily get, or don't like cropping on the small stuff, then decide whether to keep the AltAz mount or go GEM or whatever.
Lastly, AltAz is fine on planets cos they are so bright ... and also because they are so bright you can take the hyperstar off and utilise the long focal length/mag of the SCT to get decent images of the small objects (which are the planets ... all small things).
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Post by davy on Jan 6, 2017 23:50:28 GMT
On the pier side of things,i don't fancy the building blocks idea unless it's done by a pro,, to many joints in my humble opinion,,I would go with a steel tube pier or a plastic one secured in concrete and filled with concrete,, thread rod fixed to pier as per usual,,, the wedge at approx 800 is expensive,,my suggestion is a home brew barn door style wedge,,, heavy duty plate steel on a hinge with a heavy threaded rod each side to adjust your angle.. blacksmith could make it up in no time,,,,
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Post by davy on Jan 6, 2017 23:54:26 GMT
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Post by davy on Jan 6, 2017 23:57:07 GMT
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Post by davy on Jan 7, 2017 0:03:59 GMT
Look at this on eBay www.ebay.com/itm/380591228644I would use these on the threaded rod for your latitude adjustment,, think you can see where I'm coming from,, once constructed get it powder coated,, Will look like a wee thing of beauty😃
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2017 2:44:12 GMT
Thanks for your thoughts Howie and davy, Im looking really hard into this Hyperstar but it does seem to have limitations with a 8" due to you can not obstruct the front end to much! A C11 or C14 is different but my C8 well it looks as I will have to be careful on what Video camera to get as not to obstruct the front end to much. Ill keep researching.
David.
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Post by davy on Jan 7, 2017 3:09:58 GMT
Hi David,, the hyperstar I can only go with what I have read and my understanding of it and it ties in with what Howie and yourself have posted,,,no getting away from it,,, it's a cracking bit of kit,, on an eight inch scope I don't feel personally that I would buy one I don't think the 8" scope would do the price justice and I believe some of the newer usb astronomy cameras like the atik,lodestar and my current favourite the Altair hypercam 178 with the starvis sensor would be a better option on the 8" scope,, but if it was an 11 or 14" scope you already had I would go with the hyperstar,,big aperture and with the hyperstar unit cutting down the tube focal length to make it faster ,,yip that would do for me,,, only my opinion of what I've read. Cloudy nights have a few guys using these,,I would do a bit of research there,, nothing like first hand knowledge.
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Post by davy on Jan 7, 2017 3:12:14 GMT
Hi David,, have a check on Altair astro Facebook page,, some fantastic images going up just now on the 178 camera
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2017 9:58:40 GMT
Hi all, Just some updates on my progression on getting my set up sorted. Unfortunately as I can not work money is tight, so most things have to be saved for over very long periods and some items purchased second hand. Well I decided I cannot afford to change scopes so push forward with the scope I have. I put a wanted ad on IIS for a wedge for my scope , did not hold high hopes on getting on but patience is a verture! I had someone come through with one at a reasonable price. It's only been used a couple of time and the user found it a pain! Which the wedge mounted scope is , but in a Observatory it's a different beast set up once fiddlly yes but once it's done all good.
I have been told my observatory is now 2 months away so not to far now. Also I'm looking to get a solid pier to mount the wedge and scope on. But commercial piers are expensive, I was able to find a backyard steel maker who was very keen to help manufacture a pier at a very good price, so this will be a great saving. This will be done over the next month. As I have plans of the observatory we are just drawing plans of the pier now, once the wedge arrives we will finish the final details.
I purchased a reducer of Chris , but have been told it does not suit the HD 800 ! I need the actual reducer for this scope but these are not cheap $500 ridiculous! Something to sort out later.
I have I monitor and a small tv for the observatory, I have organised the electrician and the concreter and someone to help with the computer set up in the observatory! All of these people are friends and are not charging full price on all the work which is great.
So that is where I'm at for the time being. When it all starts coming together I'll start a new observatory thread ! Thanks for reading. David.
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Post by davy on Feb 19, 2017 10:15:47 GMT
Great stuff Dave,, glad it's all working out ok for you,, same boat as you just need to save the pennies for the hobby
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Post by ChrisV on Apr 19, 2017 5:51:47 GMT
Hi all, Just some updates on my progression on getting my set up sorted. Unfortunately as I can not work money is tight, so most things have to be saved for over very long periods and some items purchased second hand. Well I decided I cannot afford to change scopes so push forward with the scope I have. I put a wanted ad on IIS for a wedge for my scope , did not hold high hopes on getting on but patience is a verture! I had someone come through with one at a reasonable price. It's only been used a couple of time and the user found it a pain! Which the wedge mounted scope is , but in a Observatory it's a different beast set up once fiddlly yes but once it's done all good. I have been told my observatory is now 2 months away so not to far now. Also I'm looking to get a solid pier to mount the wedge and scope on. But commercial piers are expensive, I was able to find a backyard steel maker who was very keen to help manufacture a pier at a very good price, so this will be a great saving. This will be done over the next month. As I have plans of the observatory we are just drawing plans of the pier now, once the wedge arrives we will finish the final details. I purchased a reducer of Chris , but have been told it does not suit the HD 800 ! I need the actual reducer for this scope but these are not cheap $500 ridiculous! Something to sort out later. I have I monitor and a small tv for the observatory, I have organised the electrician and the concreter and someone to help with the computer set up in the observatory! All of these people are friends and are not charging full price on all the work which is great. So that is where I'm at for the time being. When it all starts coming together I'll start a new observatory thread ! Thanks for reading. David. Dave Was that the meade 3.3 you bought from me ? It should work, but if it doesn't suit I'll buy it back from you ! Chris
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2017 5:50:15 GMT
Hi all, hope everyone's well, I know it's been a long time since I posted but this is mainly due to health issues, i leave it at that. In between I have been busy getting my observatory together and trying to get my setup right. I still browse the net over and over to try and look to getting my set up right. But I have to just work with my scope so there limitations. But on saying that I have a wedge for my CPC and also the correct reducer for the HD 800 ( not cheap ) its been some time getting my observatory together and fully weather proof ! At this stage all my gear is in the observatory. I'm now waiting on a pier should be in the observatory within the month. Then we will get the wedge on and I'll do all that fiddling that is polar alignment lol. for Howie I have been watching your you tube videos and really keen to go down the path of astrotoaster and cannon tools. Use my 600D and see how things go! I have a couple of questions please. 1. I need to buy a laptop for this work budget ($500-$1000) any suggestions please. 2. Where do I get astrotoaster? 3. Is the 600D a good starting camera? Or should I jump in and get a decent camera right of the bat? I have attached a image of my observatory, hope you like it. thanks all. David
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Post by Dragon Man on Sept 8, 2017 6:51:47 GMT
Dave, your 600D will be great to start out with. Not being technically minded, I don't know what laptop to recommend. I think Astrotoaster has a website. Howie will be able to help with that question
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Post by ChrisV on Sept 8, 2017 7:44:42 GMT
Howie will know better and I'm sure he has a video of how to set up. But here www.astrotoaster.com/downloadMake sure you get latest version of AT and DSS as it has the drivers (or whatever the hell they are) to read camera files. And get EOS Utilities. If you haven't got this there's a fiddle to install with just the updater files. I found a youtube of some 8 year old showing how to do it !!! Edit. Love the observatory
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Post by davy on Sept 8, 2017 12:19:11 GMT
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Post by howie1 on Sept 8, 2017 13:33:06 GMT
Hi daveg,
Wedge ... good stuff as now you can go long exposures.
0.7x HD reducer (I assume that's what you meant by the correct one) ... also good ... it will cut exposure times in half compared to without it.
Laptop ... If you can fit a desktop under a desk in your Obs then that's what I'd do. Buy the gruntiest second hand desktop you can get hold of. Would beat all but the high end (expensive) laptops. If you have to have laptop, buy the gruntiest second hand laptop you can get hold of in your budget. AstroToaster uses DSS to register the images as well as stack and DSS takes lots of power to do that.
Where to get Toaster ... Here's a link to a document telling what to download, where from, and importantly the order to install each bit of software (all free BTW). I also detail the initial settings to put into DSS. And some common install probs and how to fix them. Copy the link below and paste into your browser. You should see the document, but also up near the top left side under where it says "ONEDRIVE" you should see a download link to grab a copy of the document should you need to.
onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=848D63BF1462B9EB!22914&authkey=!ADYWJocxgl_rBzw&ithint=file%2cpdf
Start with your 600d? ... yup, cos you already own it. At f/7 (with the reducer on) you'll have to try higher iso and longer than I shoot at but you should have a lot of fun with it.
Interested in what you think a decent camera might be?
cheers
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Post by ChrisV on Sept 9, 2017 1:59:18 GMT
+1 with Howie on getting a grunty desktop as you have the observatory.
The other thing with the pc - if you are thinking of doing planetary with a usb3 camera then you'll need a computer with usb3. So that's a newer more expensive laptop. But with the desktop that's not necessarily more expensive, or you can buy a usb3 card later
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